SymbOS 3.1 released

McArti0 · 09:31, 05 July 24

@Prodatron
How large a DSK file can SymbOS recognize and use?
I tried to create SS80 in WinAPE, format it as Amsdos 360 or IBM 320 but SymCommander saw only 179kB.

Prodatron · 19:03, 05 July 24

Cześć McArti, SymbOS supports the Standard CP/M Formats for the CPC and PCW (Data, system and PCW SD). As the memory is limited for the File Manager Module and FAT allows to support any floppy (even 2,8mb) and harddisc sizes (2tb), there are currently no plans to support any additional CP/m Like Formats as this would require additional memory for the Code. As Long as there are No concepts for extending the File Manager Module to additional memory this wont Change

McArti0 · 20:08, 05 July 24

@Prodatron.
So what should I do with a DSK formatted on e.g. SS80 or DS80 to have FAT on it?

GUNHED · 16:01, 09 July 24

Quote from: Prodatron on 19:03, 05 July 24Cześć McArti, SymbOS supports the Standard CP/M Formats for the CPC and PCW (Data, system and PCW SD). As the memory is limited for the File Manager Module and FAT allows to support any floppy (even 2,8mb) and harddisc sizes (2tb), there are currently no plans to support any additional CP/m Like Formats as this would require additional memory for the Code. As Long as there are No concepts for extending the File Manager Module to additional memory this wont Change

Can you please show us the 2,8MB floppy disc being used by symbos?

HAL6128 · 16:12, 09 July 24

Quote from: McArti0 on 20:08, 05 July 24@Prodatron.
So what should I do with a DSK formatted on e.g. SS80 or DS80 to have FAT on it?

Maybe the HxC Floppy Emulator application can manipulate DSK files in that way?

McArti0 · 16:23, 09 July 24

More like CPC program formats disks as FAT. Discology? It would be best if SymbOS had a format command. Or Prodatron put an empty large DSK FAT disk here.

HAL6128 · 17:49, 09 July 24

With Linux you can create an empty FAT12-Image (720k):
1. dd if=/dev/zero of=floppy.dsk bs=512 count=1440
2. mkfs.vfat -F12 floppy.dsk

McArti0 · 18:17, 09 July 24

Quote from: HAL6128 on 17:49, 09 July 24With Linux you can create an empty FAT12-Image (720k):

But it is IMG raw format. It's not DSK format file yet.

GUNHED · 21:46, 09 July 24

DSK-CPC can copy to / from 720 KB DOS format (in runs on CPC!).
And there is of course (on CPC) DOS-COPY too.
One of them could be able to format a disc (but I don't remember exactly).

HAL6128 · 22:11, 09 July 24

Quote from: McArti0 on 18:17, 09 July 24
Quote from: HAL6128 on 17:49, 09 July 24With Linux you can create an empty FAT12-Image (720k):
But it is IMG raw format. It's not DSK format file yet.
Quote from: McArti0 on 18:17, 09 July 24
Quote from: HAL6128 on 17:49, 09 July 24With Linux you can create an empty FAT12-Image (720k):
But it is IMG raw format. It's not DSK format file yet.

try a cumbersome and dirty hack and copy all the hex figures from the raw image (open it with WinHex) into the WinApe Edit mode of the disc (bootsec, fat tables, root dir). just kidding.
BoonyDos has also Fat12 support , maybe a Format command included?

McArti0 · 22:12, 09 July 24

Ok. make handy BDB in IBM DS80 DSK by HEX_Editor.

McArti0 · 22:45, 09 July 24

Quote from: HAL6128 on 22:11, 09 July 24try a cumbersome and dirty hack and copy all the hex figures from the raw image (open it with WinHex) into the WinApe Edit mode of the disc (bootsec, fat tables, root dir). just kidding

This is exactly what I did. I have paper DOS 5.0 documentation, so I filled the BDB table with ~60 bytes

By filling E5, DSK thought it was full, so I reset the first FAT and it worked. I have 625kB with directories on DSK. Tomorrow I will check if it works with Gotek.

Prodatron · 15:08, 10 July 24

Nice compilation! Many years ago someone was posting here a DSK image of a 360K FAT12 disc dump (see attachement).
Your format is a little bit special, as it has only 8 sectors/track, so it has the special size of 640K.
Was that an original IBM format for FAT discs? (not listed here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floppy_disk#Sizes,_performance_and_capacity )
Anyway as you can see, thanks to FAT(12) you can read any stuff, doesn't matter how many sectors/tracks/sides, as long as the hardware can access it. On the Enterprise 64/128 they are still using FAT12 for accessing "large" partitions on SD cards.

McArti0 · 16:02, 10 July 24

The CPC firmware natively supports the 8s40t1h format where sectors are counted from 1 to 8. It is called IBM SS40. Amsdos sees it as 154kB and respects sector 0.
I will try to make a disk that boots symbos from amsdos and is large.

Prodatron · 16:07, 10 July 24

You want to mix CP/M and FAT12 filesystems on one disc?
IIRC the "IBM format" (8 sectors/track, sector offset #00) for CP/M style discs don't have a system track, so it would try to read the directory starting from the sector at LBA 0. But at this place there is the boot sector of a FAT disc. But probably I didn't get your idea.

McArti0 · 16:25, 10 July 24

Quote from: Prodatron on 16:07, 10 July 24, so it would try to read the directory starting from the sector at LBA 0. But at this place there is the boot sector of a FAT disc. But probably I didn't get your idea.

Amsdos on disk IBM It skips the entire track 0. The directory is on track 1. Amsdos knows something about IBM 8spt.

Prodatron · 16:58, 10 July 24

Quote from: McArti0 on 16:25, 10 July 24
Quote from: Prodatron on 16:07, 10 July 24, so it would try to read the directory starting from the sector at LBA 0. But at this place there is the boot sector of a FAT disc. But probably I didn't get your idea.
Amsdos on disk IBM It skips the entire track 0. The directory is on track 1. Amsdos knows something about IBM 8spt.

Oh yes, now I remembers! Cool! That makes it possible to have a hybrid disc with both Filesystem!

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SymbOS 3.1 released